| miniradman says : In case nobody here remembers the charter they've ticked when signing up to the forums (although it was Forgotten in the technical guide), heavy political and religious arguments/discussions (which are non-metal related) are banned from the forums... Arguments like this cause problems which shouldn't exist (especially on a Metal site). |
| InfinityZero says : Replying to gayboy, the argument you make is all too common with Christian apologists, and it's illogical as well. Here's a quote from the magic carpenter himself: "Think not that I am come to destroy The Law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill." (Matthew 5:17) |
| Jesus also says that people need to love him more than they do their own family. They need to have unwavering Blind Faith in him for no real reason other than he seems to know how to do magic. |
| He also constantly makes threats of Hell and Damnation, going so Far as to damn three whole cities to Burn forever (Matthew 11:20-24). |
| He says he comes to Earth wielding a Sword i which to cut Down sinners and cast people into Hell and turn families against each other (Matthew 10:34-37). |
| At one point he criticizes the Pharisees for not murdering their disobedient children (Matthew 15:4-7). |
| Even if Jesus Ever existed |
| I won't even get into Moses' Insanity, since he was even worse after bringing the Israelites to Sinai. All that Power went to his Head and he started murdering people left and right (under God's command, of course!). |
| Also, political events are no way of proving the Existence or the lack of Existence of a diety. |
| I could argue that the countries with the highest quality of life have fewer Christians (all of Scandanavia, for example) |
| and many places with extremely rigid theistic laws have very low qualities of life. Look at the United States. As you enter the Bible Belt, the education levels plummet and the violence levels rise. |
| Explain to me why it is logical to believe in GOD, please! |
| There is little doubt of Jesus' Existence among scholars and historians. you're just being an edgy faggot by saying that and you're showing off your historical ignorance. |
| InfinityZero says : I agree with miniradman. Gayboy, try not to directly Insult me. |
| It completely undermines your argurments, which are poor to begin with. Saying "God is perfect because he's perfect therefore whatever he says is A-Okay" is a weak argument. Every religion has its own GOD who is perfect and unquestionable. What makes yours special? |
| Also, if GOD existed, I wouldn't follow him. He's Evil and bloodthirsty and psychotic and spews trivial rules out left and right. People can't work on the Sabbath, |
| people can't wear mixed fabrics, |
| people can't be gay |
| people can't think for themselves. |
| This is not a deity I would follow. The Fact that you are not bothered by a crazy MAN in the sky killing millions for almost no reason just because he's labelled a GOD in a bronze-age superstitious body of text is sort of worrying to me. |
| Calling me an edgy faggot is again besides the point. I might as well say that you are religious because you are in defiance against your Atheist parents. |
| Things like this don't make a difference. What matters is backing up what you say. You say that a lot of historians have proof of Jesus, but you don't provide links to any scholarly articles |
| Oh, and here are some articles to fill in the gaps in my information before:http://epiphenom.fieldofscience.com/2009/06/atheist-nations-are-more-peaceful.html |
| http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Europe_belief_in_god.svghttp://www.infobarrel.com/25_Most_Atheist_Countries_in_the_World |
| I want to point out again that I'm not trying to say 'atheists are more peaceful'. I'm trying to point out that there is ample evidence to show that theocracies don't work well compared to Freedom of religion. |
| Also, please stop using anti-Semitic slang. Once again, saying "Jewry" this and "kike" that totally undermines your arguments. |
| I'm not sure which of the Bible's teachings that you're picking and choosing from, but if you're taking from the 'love thy neighbor' fluff, you're kinda failing. D: |
gayboy has been warned for this message 
| gayboy says : Do you think the early Christians, who witnesses Jesus first Hand, would willfuly Die at the Hands of the Romans for a MAN who didn't exist? |
| InfinityZero says : Every religion involves people Dying for people who don't exist. People used to wage huge wars over the Greek/Roman Gods |
| You say that because your GOD conquered others (involving millions upon millions of murders, as I mentioned before), but what about the thousands of years before Christianity's rise when many other polytheistic religions made up people's beliefs? |
| Christianity is a relatively recent religion--a religion which is beginning to dwindle. |
| In the US, the number of non-religious people has more than doubled from 14.3 Million in 1990 to 29.4 Million in 2001; their proportion has grown from just Eight percent of the total in 1990 to over fourteen percent in 2001. http://www.gc.cuny.edu/CUNY_GC/media/CUNY-Graduate-Center/PDF/ARIS/ARIS-PDF-version.pdf (It's on page 13) |
| Also: "For truly, I say to you, till Heaven and Earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass The Law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of Heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” (Matthew 5:18-19) |
| “It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of The Law to become invalid.” (Luke 16:17) |
| I would like to see a quote or Two where Jesus says to change the rules, because I haven't found any. I can see him bitching a lot of people out on not following certain rules properly, though. |
| When I mentioned people couldn't think for themselves, I was referring to God's rigid rules such as 'circumcise your kids or else', or 'don't eat from this Tree or else' or 'don't eat the wrong food or else'. |
| I scanned your list of references to see if I'd read any or heard about any of their authors, and Saw that you have "Wells, George A. (1988). The Historical Evidence for Jesus". Dude, George A. Wells is an Atheist whose book examines the idea of Jesus as a mythological figure and presents evidence that the people who wrote about him wouldn't have had any contact with him. I Saw that Ian Wilson's book deals largely with the obviously fake Shroud of Turin, whose 'imprint' of Jesus' body is proportionately inaccurate, not to mention the Fact that the shroud was dated as being from the 1300s and that over 40 so-called Shrouds of Turin exist elsewhere. Michael Grant's book seems to be an argument that Jesus existed but had no connection to a deity. I'm not sure I want to spend time investigating your other sources if they're middle-of-the-road at best. You seem to not have bothered checking on the sources yourself, especially since one of your citations supports my side of the argument. |